WWIII

[tmttactical]

Quote Proud Prepper: I don't have the time to explain it to you. It's not really important. I'll sum it up. Russia will not expand into Europe, unless it's a necessity to there defense. They just wish to be left alone.

Nobody forced Russia to invade. They chose to become involved. Since you failed to answer any of my questions and chose to use the limp wrist approach of not having the time to explain, I will mark you down as not having an answer to my questions.

Quote Garp58: I am sorry to defer. PUTIN WAS INVITED INTO THE CRIMEA.......The eastern Ukrainians who were being killed (14,000 in about 8 years) cried for help just as the Cosovo cried for help, Croatia cried for help, Bosnia cried for help and NATO got together and bombed the hell out of the Serbs.....NOBODY HELPED THE EASTERN UKRAINIANS.

Major difference the Ukrainian government did not ask Russia to invade, the Ukrainian rebels asked Russia for help. As for the United Nations, they are a complete joke and the biggest waste of money.14,000 Ukrainians died in 8 years before Russia invaded. After Russia invaded how many Ukrainians have died? Still nobody has answered the questions. Who has benefited from Russia invading the Ukraine? Who gave Russian the right to force another nation to become a "Buffer Nation"? At least Garp58 has tried to explain why Russia invaded. Has anybody every noticed that the world powers always have a problem with the perceived weaker nations? If the Western Nations are the villain's, why don't these Super Power nations declare war against their perceived foe's? Every bully nation, America included, can and will find a reason to attack those nations that don't toe the party line, if they are weaker opponents. It is always the military and civilians that suffer the losses. The people in charge rant and rave but never suffer to consequences. I don't care how bad a government is, that is the problem of the people to deal with, just like it is here in America. We may have to take up arms in an attempt to fix our problems but I do not and will not support any foreign nations coming into help fix us. Pointing fingers at America and saying they did it, so we can too is schoolyard tactics. America has done a lot of very stupid things but that does not excuse Putin and Russia from their stupid invasion.

Here is the bottom line. Putin was convinced he could invade and defeat Ukraine within weeks and have his "Buffer State". What I don't know or can prove is why Putin believed he could win the invasion in such a short time frame. Was he mislead by his own administration? Was he suckered into invading by the West? Did the west deliberately entice Putin to invade by not taking more action after he invaded the Chimera? Lots of questions but none of them have anything to do with justification of the invasion. Mexico brings in illegal drugs that kill thousands of Americans every year. China makes the drugs that Mexico smuggles in. America know this and can prove it but America has not declared war on Mexico or China. Nations go to war after they evaluate the gain / loss factor. America does not go to war with Mexico or China because there is not profit in it. Russia did not go to war with the Ukraine until the government changed course and they thought they could win a quick war and gain a buffer state and improve their economy. They guessed wrong. Now we all are paying the price. I don't care if Hitler was running the Ukraine, as long as he did not invade any other countries. That was the problem for the Ukrainians.

Now for the next phase of thought. What lay ahead for the Ukraine and Russia? If Russia does win and the west stops providing massive open military aid, Russia is going to be faced with huge rebuilding costs and a guerilla war. Of course the Ukraine leaders will be given sanctuary and will be able to keep a war going for decades. Now god forbid, Ukraine forces Russia to leave, then more and more predatorial nations start looking at Russia for their next meal. Russia needs to declare victory, move back within Russian borders and stop the madness from escalating. There re no good guys or bad guys, just stupid and more stupid people. Every war has clear winners and it is not the people fighting it.

 

[Mountain Dragon]

In fact it dosn't matter who eat the other ones candy.

Fact is we're so close to the next world war like 1939.
Fact is - delivery weapons and ammo don't force peace.
Fact is - when you invite only ONE side to negotations about an endig of an war it wouldn't help. Just not inviting the other side is not an diplomatic way - it's just kindergarden of political leaders.
Fact is - it does not look as the West seriously wanna talk about peace.
Fact is - the USA, EU and the NATO provocate an WW3 with all power they have. The only thing the West dosn't have are balls. If - then they almost would send an missile to Moscow. But it dosn't look good in history chronicel. Especially for Germany, for them it would be the 3rd time they are in the "starter crew" in 3 World Wars.

However, i'm bored to hear or read how good and peacefull the western nations are and how bad and criminal all other countries are.
To the West i can only say: We're going to loose in any case. Economical we lost in Europe already to "protect" and support one of the most corrupt countries on western hemisphere. And the worldwide political power is damaged like never before, in fact it's almost history too.

And in all this western arrogance about beeing the world leaders nibody sees really - or don't wanna see it - in meantime the BRICS states are more powerfull than the western alliance.
BTW - if the NATO attacs Russia the West will be history. Don't forget China or all the Arabic Countries who have still open bills with the USA or Europe.

So, stop to discuss who has stolen the other ones jelly bears or who is the innocent! Guilty are all involved parties!

 

[tmttactical]

Gary, you have stated the problem correctly. No country is the good guy. Not the west and not any other country. They are all jackals waiting for the right moment to attack. TPTB do not want a strong, stable world. They want world wide conflict. Gary is also correct that the west does not want this war to end and fights it in a cowardly manner. The west wants to drain Russia finances, manpower and equipment. No nation, including Russia is safe. China is watching and waiting on the side lines. China is busy building it's military and is stockpiling all it's ammo and missiles. The Ukraine is losing everything and will gain nothing in the end. The west is not the world savior, it is just one more jackal waiting for an opportunity to strike, America was not designated the guardian of the world. That is a self imposed label that nobody else wants or believes. The United Nations is simply a money pool that does nothing worthwhile. It cannot force nations to respect other nations borders. It cannot even pass or condemn a major nation verbally, without permission from all the big boys at the table. What a financial joke. That is why I say that Russia must wake up and quit playing the dupe. They need to declare they have driven all the Nazis from the Ukraine. Pull back their troops and let the Ukraine deal with the after math. That approach would force the western nations into putting their resources into a more constructive direction or be labeled hypocrites. If the Ukrainian government is as bad as some claim, then it will collapse without a boogeyman to blame for it's trouble. The Ukraine has just become a live fire military testing ground. The war is also an excuse to ship tax fee grain and damage other nations farmers. I am willing to bet the Ukrainian farmers did not benefit from this deal but the middlemen got richer.

Russia is not the bad guy. The Ukraine is not the bad guy. Both are misused tools. Do I want Russia to go back home, you bet I do. Do I want more money poured into the Ukraine to rebuild , no I don't. Nations need to learn there is no benefit from warfare. No new territory to be gained. No financial support for harrowing their neighbors. Nations should be free to join whatever organization they believe best helps them. Be it NATO or BRICS. If all the authoritarian nations want to join BRICS, go for it. If all the Democratic / Republican nations want to join NATO. good for them. If the world was divided into just two side, then the fingers on the nuclear buttons would go away and the fighting would just be confined within each group. Will all war end, never, as long as humans control. We tend to be a greedy self serving species.

If the nations of the world lived like Gary, then we would all prosper, unfortunately they don't. No nation, America included, should benefit from invading another nation, no matter the perceived cause.

 

[ban1985]

Even if we are not of the same opinion on everything, which is also a good thing, a good Tip from me.

Prepare for a Nuclear War by all means, no matter where you live, just do it, because it will come.

 

[ban1985]

Gary, you have stated the problem correctly. No country is the good guy. Not the west and not any other country. They are all jackals waiting for the right moment to attack. TPTB do not want a strong, stable world. They want world wide conflict. Gary is also correct that the west does not want this war to end and fights it in a cowardly manner. The west wants to drain Russia finances, manpower and equipment. No nation, including Russia is safe. China is watching and waiting on the side lines. China is busy building it's military and is stockpiling all it's ammo and missiles. The Ukraine is losing everything and will gain nothing in the end. The west is not the world savior, it is just one more jackal waiting for an opportunity to strike, America was not designated the guardian of the world. That is a self imposed label that nobody else wants or believes. The United Nations is simply a money pool that does nothing worthwhile. It cannot force nations to respect other nations borders. It cannot even pass or condemn a major nation verbally, without permission from all the big boys at the table. What a financial joke. That is why I say that Russia must wake up and quit playing the dupe. They need to declare they have driven all the Nazis from the Ukraine. Pull back their troops and let the Ukraine deal with the after math. That approach would force the western nations into putting their resources into a more constructive direction or be labeled hypocrites. If the Ukrainian government is as bad as some claim, then it will collapse without a boogeyman to blame for it's trouble. The Ukraine has just become a live fire military testing ground. The war is also an excuse to ship tax fee grain and damage other nations farmers. I am willing to bet the Ukrainian farmers did not benefit from this deal but the middlemen got richer.

Russia is not the bad guy. The Ukraine is not the bad guy. Both are misused tools. Do I want Russia to go back home, you bet I do. Do I want more money poured into the Ukraine to rebuild , no I don't. Nations need to learn there is no benefit from warfare. No new territory to be gained. No financial support for harrowing their neighbors. Nations should be free to join whatever organization they believe best helps them. Be it NATO or BRICS. If all the authoritarian nations want to join BRICS, go for it. If all the Democratic / Republican nations want to join NATO. good for them. If the world was divided into just two side, then the fingers on the nuclear buttons would go away and the fighting would just be confined within each group. Will all war end, never, as long as humans control. We tend to be a greedy self serving species.

If the nations of the world lived like Gary, then we would all prosper, unfortunately they don't. No nation, America included, should benefit from invading another nation, no matter the perceived cause.

Thanks

 

[DrHenley]

Remember the non-Christian golden rule? He who has the gold makes the rule. China has been buying gold like crazy for decades. While the US stockpile is maybe non existent by now.

The price of gold has always been my barometer for reading the state of the world's economy. There are limits to how long they can suppress it, and it looks like that limit has been breached.

 

[DrHenley]

Dang, it's still going up: $2177!

 

[tmttactical]

Even if we are not of the same opinion on everything, which is also a good thing, a good Tip from me.

Prepare for a Nuclear War by all means, no matter where you live, just do it, because it will come.

I will have to differ from Ban1985.

I would not spend a single penny dedicated to surviving a nuclear war. Yes please do prep for everything short of a nuclear war. Three reasons for my opinion.

1) I don't think any nation / leader is stupid enough to start a worldwide nuclear war, so the special structures and equipment are wasted resources.

2) Even if you had the financial resources (millions), the proper location (away from any nuclear targets or nuclear power plants) you would not be able to survive a nuclear winter, lasting many years if not decades. Prep for EMP, prep for CMP, prep for social collapse and prep for economic collapse. Those are survivable. A nuclear winter is an extinction event.

3) Who would want to exist in nuclear wasteland, even if you were lucky enough to survive the nuclear winter?

 

[DrHenley]

If you can't survive the immediate aftermath of a nuclear event without extreme preparation like totally filtered air, radiation proof water and food supply, and radiation proof PPE, you probably won't survive long afterwards. And you probably will not want to anyhow.

 

[EastenerWesterner]

If you evaluate where the targets are, (40 miles away for me), prevailing winds,terrain, etc. You can make a plan for the fallout.
If it works, it works. If it doesn’t, you were going to be dead anyway. Just try to increase your odds.

 

[tmttactical]

If you evaluate where the targets are, (40 miles away for me), prevailing winds,terrain, etc. You can make a plan for the fallout.
If it works, it works. If it doesn’t, you were going to be dead anyway. Just try to increase your odds.

You are only focused on the immediate fallout problem, What about the next week, month, years weather pattern? How do you survive the nuclear winter? Which is the real killer issue. That is the point I am making for not spending any money on nuclear preps. If the fallout does not reach you, then you don't need any special equipment or special structures. If it does reach you then you are going to die anyway, so again, no need for special equipment or buildings.

 

[EastenerWesterner]

You are only focused on the immediate fallout problem, What about the next week, month, years weather pattern? How do you survive the nuclear winter? Which is the real killer issue. That is the point I am making for not spending any money on nuclear preps. If the fallout does not reach you, then you don't need any special equipment or special structures. If it does reach you then you are going to die anyway, so again, no need for special equipment or buildings.

I have a minimal $ amount in fall out preps. Enough for a couple weeks. One of the advantages of the left coast with a west wind.
Is a disaster going to change the wind patterns? If so I am a goner.
You can only go so far, you can’t prep for everything. This rabbit hole is deep enough

 

[tmttactical]

I have a minimal $ amount in fall out preps. Enough for a couple weeks. One of the advantages of the left coast with a west wind.
Is a disaster going to change the wind patterns? If so I am a goner.
You can only go so far, you can’t prep for everything. This rabbit hole is deep enough

I absolutely agree the rabbit hole is deep enough, too deep for some of us retired / senior folks. That is why I say, prep for what you can survive and don't worry about what you can't. I won't need a dosage meter to tell my hair is falling out faster than normal. OR a Geiger counter to tell me I am screwed. Having to share the road with the cold white fluffy stuff in July will also be a big hint I am screwed.

 

[ban1985]

I will have to differ from Ban1985.

I would not spend a single penny dedicated to surviving a nuclear war. Yes please do prep for everything short of a nuclear war. Three reasons for my opinion.

1) I don't think any nation / leader is stupid enough to start a worldwide nuclear war, so the special structures and equipment are wasted resources.

2) Even if you had the financial resources (millions), the proper location (away from any nuclear targets or nuclear power plants) you would not be able to survive a nuclear winter, lasting many years if not decades. Prep for EMP, prep for CMP, prep for social collapse and prep for economic collapse. Those are survivable. A nuclear winter is an extinction event.

3) Who would want to exist in nuclear wasteland, even if you were lucky enough to survive the nuclear winter?

You're right about points 2 and 3, but I'm not so sure about point 1.
I don't know if you realize what's going on in Europe. This week, German politicians are publicly telling journalists that there should be a missile strike against the Kremlin or the Russian Ministry of Defense, i.e. to obliterate these buildings and their contents.
What will the response be, regardless of whether Putin then flies over the Jordan with a few hundred military personnel? the response will come back automatically and probably nuclear. Whether it's big nuclear weapons or small ones, it doesn't matter, it could trigger the Russian system dead hand.

The Germans want a strike against Russia, the French and the British anyway.
Always expect Europe to try to drag the USA into this shit, at the moment it's really possible.
Then the third piece of the puzzle comes to light: whoever is crazy enough to launch a nuclear strike is sitting on your floor and his name is Joe Biden.

We are surrounded by idiots and the danger of a nuclear strike has never been higher. Honestly, if it happens nearby I don't want to survive it either, but since I'm surrounded by mountains and my neighborhood is of no use to Uncle Vlad I might get lucky, but in the long run living in the stone age sure isn't fun and you don't get old.

 

[tmttactical]

You're right about points 2 and 3, but I'm not so sure about point 1.
I don't know if you realize what's going on in Europe. This week, German politicians are publicly telling journalists that there should be a missile strike against the Kremlin or the Russian Ministry of Defense, i.e. to obliterate these buildings and their contents.
What will the response be, regardless of whether Putin then flies over the Jordan with a few hundred military personnel? the response will come back automatically and probably nuclear. Whether it's big nuclear weapons or small ones, it doesn't matter, it could trigger the Russian system dead hand.

The Germans want a strike against Russia, the French and the British anyway.
Always expect Europe to try to drag the USA into this shit, at the moment it's really possible.
Then the third piece of the puzzle comes to light: whoever is crazy enough to launch a nuclear strike is sitting on your floor and his name is Joe Biden.

We are surrounded by idiots and the danger of a nuclear strike has never been higher. Honestly, if it happens nearby I don't want to survive it either, but since I'm surrounded by mountains and my neighborhood is of no use to Uncle Vlad I might get lucky, but in the long run living in the stone age sure isn't fun and you don't get old.

Politicians talk out of both sides of they mouths and a lower portion of their anatomy. The nuke talk has been going on since nukes were invented. The Powers to be want to remake to world for their benefit. A nuked world benefits nobody. Russia will not be invaded. China will not be invaded and America will not be invaded. When I say invaded, I am referencing a large military forces. Will there be border battles, you bet but they will stay conventional. My biggest fear is that Russia will become to weakened by these constant wars, that China will use the excuse that Siberia used to belong to the Qin dynasty and invade Russian to get all the Siberian resources. If China figured for a minute it could defeat Russia, it would turn on them in a heartbeat. If you study Chinese history, China's various provinces would sign treaties and make alliances, until one side or the other had an advantage and then they would attack their ally. Modern China has not change from past practices. Russia is currently the main course on the worlds dinner menu. China is in the kitchen just waiting to start carving up the meal.

 

[ban1985]

You're right about a lot of things, that's true. But before China visits Russia, it will visit Taiwan.
But I'm still keeping an eye on something that doesn't enjoy any attention at the moment.

North Korea.

 

[Mountain Dragon]

When i take an look to the political wasteland those days i' m not sure about if not someone press the button even he die second.
And politicans are selfish enough to think to survive anything in their bunker during the own people go grilled.

 

[tmttactical]

You're right about a lot of things, that's true. But before China visits Russia, it will visit Taiwan.
But I'm still keeping an eye on something that doesn't enjoy any attention at the moment.

North Korea.

If Russia manages to get out of Ukraine with a relatively whole skin, then I think China will continue to crave / focus on Taiwan. If Russia is weakened too much, then I think China will go after Siberia. Too many western and Asian forces will come together to help defend Taiwan, making that venture very costly. Who is going to come to Russia's defense, if China invades Siberia? Both nations are willing to feed the meat grinders and will not be concerned over loss of military personnel. The people in Siberia may or may not support Russia, as there is a strong desire to become independent from Russia. Russia drew a lot of "Cannon Fodder" from the ethnic minorities to fight in Ukraine and that has left a bitter taste in the mouths of a lot of folks.

As for north Korea, they love to talk a big game but they do not have the logistics to fight a major war. Conventional wars are very expensive to fight and North Korea is a very poor nation. China would support North Korea, provided there was something in it for China. Again as for nukes, no win for anybody. In any case there is nothing we can do except continue prepping.

 

[GeorgiaPeachie]

I think China will continue to crave / focus on Taiwan. If Russia is weakened too much, then I think China will go after Siberia. Too many western and Asian forces will come together to help defend Taiwan, making that venture very costly. Who is going to come to Russia's defense, if China invades Siberia?

That is an interesting question. My first thought was no one, then the second was…probably more than we think IF they see it as a way of getting their hands on Russian natural resources. After all, beyond the fight over controlling the entire world, a major part of that is to control the resources!

 

[ban1985]

If Russia manages to get out of Ukraine with a relatively whole skin, then I think China will continue to crave / focus on Taiwan. If Russia is weakened too much, then I think China will go after Siberia. Too many western and Asian forces will come together to help defend Taiwan, making that venture very costly. Who is going to come to Russia's defense, if China invades Siberia? Both nations are willing to feed the meat grinders and will not be concerned over loss of military personnel. The people in Siberia may or may not support Russia, as there is a strong desire to become independent from Russia. Russia drew a lot of "Cannon Fodder" from the ethnic minorities to fight in Ukraine and that has left a bitter taste in the mouths of a lot of folks.

As for north Korea, they love to talk a big game but they do not have the logistics to fight a major war. Conventional wars are very expensive to fight and North Korea is a very poor nation. China would support North Korea, provided there was something in it for China. Again as for nukes, no win for anybody. In any case there is nothing we can do except continue prepping.

Many people from the "ethnic minorities" in Russia have volunteered for the "special operation" and you should not underestimate these people.
Russia can in no way be compared with Europe or the USA, you won't find any WOKE or trans types in the country (except perhaps in the sewers of the big cities where the scum belongs) and they are damn proud of their country and there are still enough patriots there who would die for their country if they had to.

Chinese and Siberia, it's possible, but Siberia is damn hard, hard climate, hard people, and Uncle Vlad also has nuclear missiles stationed there. The Chinese boss may be smart, Putin is too, I think there are some capable people in Moscow who don't miss anything, and the Chinese will be aware that an invasion towards Russia will also do him some damage, he could visit Japan first.