Random encounters

[tmttactical]

Jesus Christ, WHAT'S THE SCENARIO?!?!? The goal posts keep moving. Is it one guy looking for spare parts, or is it a group of marauders shooting at you first?

Original Post: Marauders are not soldiers fighting for their country. They are not a salvage party. Marauders are low life scum and need to be exterminated once thy have show their intentions. March any survivors out a ways, have them dig the holes. Save one survivor to close all the holes but one. That one you will have to close up yourselves.

 

[BillMasen]

Original Post: Marauders are not soldiers fighting for their country. They are not a salvage party. Marauders are low life scum and need to be exterminated once thy have show their intentions. March any survivors out a ways, have them dig the holes. Save one survivor to close all the holes but one. That one you will have to close up yourselves.

So if you and your family go out on a salvage operation and another group decides YOU are marauders on their territory you wont object if they deem you the bad guy and execute you , because YOU deem yourself judge jury and executioner to others so surely they can judge you the same way??

 

[tmttactical]

So if you and your family go out on a salvage operation and another group decides YOU are marauders on their territory you wont object if they deem you the bad guy and execute you , because YOU deem yourself judge jury and executioner to others so surely they can judge you the same way??

If we have reached the point of WROL and you have attacked my group, then don' plan on surrendering. Once anybody opens fire on me or mine, then it will be a fight to the finish. We will not surrender and I guarantee we will will not keep prisoners. During WROL we are judge, jury and executor if the situation is warranted. Since by definition there is no law " WROL =Without Rule Of Law " The group, community or leader will decide the fate of any Marauders. In my group, the fate of Marauders are predetermined. Shifting away from the original post "Marauders" and moving over to salvage parties. People exploring outside their normal location, will do so at risk. Some groups / communities may be open to trade. Some groups will not be open to any form of trade or outsider salvage. Once the SHTF big time, any contact with outsiders will contain a certain amount of risk. The explorers of the world (new or old) have and will always face dangers of the unknown. The liberal feel good concepts will not apply once the veneer of civilization (rule of law) fades away. If you plan to venture outside your territory, then you had better perform your due diligence and recon the area you plan to enter. Learn about the people in that territory. If they appear to be overtly militaristic, it may be wise to stay out of their area. If they appear to be just survivors, then a very cautious approach to making contact could be instituted. Note tied to stick with cloth flag, left in a main trail could be the start of communications. SIASD, if enter into another groups territory, looking and acting like potential marauders, then you are probably going to get treating like marauders.

 

[BillMasen]

If we have reached the point of WROL and you have attacked my group, then don' plan on surrendering. Once anybody opens fire on me or mine, then it will be a fight to the finish. We will not surrender and I guarantee we will will not keep prisoners. During WROL we are judge, jury and executor if the situation is warranted. Since by definition there is no law " WROL =Without Rule Of Law " The group, community or leader will decide the fate of any Marauders. In my group, the fate of Marauders are predetermined. Shifting away from the original post "Marauders" and moving over to salvage parties. People exploring outside their normal location, will do so at risk. Some groups / communities may be open to trade. Some groups will not be open to any form of trade or outsider salvage. Once the SHTF big time, any contact with outsiders will contain a certain amount of risk. The explorers of the world (new or old) have and will always face dangers of the unknown. The liberal feel good concepts will not apply once the veneer of civilization (rule of law) fades away. If you plan to venture outside your territory, then you had better perform your due diligence and recon the area you plan to enter. Learn about the people in that territory. If they appear to be overtly militaristic, it may be wise to stay out of their area. If they appear to be just survivors, then a very cautious approach to making contact could be instituted. Note tied to stick with cloth flag, left in a main trail could be the start of communications. SIASD, if enter into another groups territory, looking and acting like potential marauders, then you are probably going to get treating like marauders.

Read my point again, First who decides there is no rule of law? At what point is it declared and by Whom? Next they have not attacked your group, You and your group have gone out foraging or salvaging and you enter someone elses area, So in their eyes YOU are the criminals/ trespassers, marauders you crossed THEIR threshold which make YOU the attacker . So you must agree THEY are as entitled as you to kill you guys on sight, it is as simple as that because on THEIR turf THEY are judge jury and executioner as you are on your turf. The point I make is ALL groups of survivors have the same rights on THEIR turf as you do on yours.

Think about it, A group of preppers it could be your group or any other group are displaced or driven by need from your own turf, You have to hunt/ gather/ scavage/ salvage because your own turf is unavailable for what ever reason. So you are going to kill on sight a salvage group entering your area and they are going to do the same to you. You have already decided that YOU will decide how these others are categorised and how you will attack them on sight, so its only fair they apply the same logic on meeting your group of your reservation with the same approach.

 

[BillMasen]

Lets look again as the original post """
After a long term SHTF situation we have a good number of ppl we trust and plan to form a small colony. Surviving on your own will be pretty much impossible in my opinion.
One thing we cant fully agree on....what to do with random people/groups that will ocasionaly find us? I see only 2 options which are
1. Take them in
2. Take them out
3. Would be taking prisoners but that would be a waste of resources.
What do you think?


Now consider the 50 percent chance it is YOUR group who is disposessed and seeking another colony to merge with, Should 1 THEY take YOUR group in OR should 2 THEY do what many of you suggest and " take YOU out" on sight or 3 should they take you prisoner ?

 

[BillMasen]

I love these interlectual brain storming threads they help us all analyse issues we have not fully considered. Its better than Chess. There are some darm good thinkers on this forum Urbanprep always gets my gears grinding, Garys clear considered logic, Mavs watchful oversight. etc Lets hope to god we never find out who is right .

 

[DrHenley]

Some of the discussions have made me forget what the original question was. There are so many answers to "what do you do with violent marauders" it made me start thinking that was the question. IT WAS NOT!!!

If you want to discuss what to do with violent marauders that attack you, start a different thread!

THIS was the question:

One thing we cant fully agree on....what to do with random people/groups that will ocasionaly find us? I see only 2 options which are
1. Take them in
2. Take them out
3. Would be taking prisoners but that would be a waste of resources.

What do you think?amp.
Considering you have a family in your c
What to do with a random stranger showing up asking to join your camp/colony. Taking him/her in is a big risk but if you refuse and let him wander off you risk that the person will find another group and return to raid your place.
What if its a family or a group of 10 people?

How would you determine who to take in and what would you do with the ones you dont want to join you?

OK, now that I have refreshed my memory, I can think more clearly about this, and my original answer is the same.

Quarantine them and put them to work.

They don't get to come into the main camp, not for a long time. The quarantine camp is what they will most likely find wandering about. The main camp is in a more obscure location that you don't just stumble across. They will not be told where it is.

You don't work, you don't eat. That will separate the people with good intentions from the ne'er-do-wells who won't like being put to work. Honest people honestly needing help will gladly work for their supper and for a bit of stability and security.

 

[Jayson]

Sorry, but any random people that wander into my neck of the woods can just keep moving. They had just as much time to prepare for when the SHTF as I have. Charity begins at home.

 

[tmttactical]

Read my point again, First who decides there is no rule of law? At what point is it declared and by Whom? Next they have not attacked your group, You and your group have gone out foraging or salvaging and you enter someone elses area, So in their eyes YOU are the criminals/ trespassers, marauders you crossed THEIR threshold which make YOU the attacker . So you must agree THEY are as entitled as you to kill you guys on sight, it is as simple as that because on THEIR turf THEY are judge jury and executioner as you are on your turf. The point I make is ALL groups of survivors have the same rights on THEIR turf as you do on yours.

Think about it, A group of preppers it could be your group or any other group are displaced or driven by need from your own turf, You have to hunt/ gather/ scavage/ salvage because your own turf is unavailable for what ever reason. So you are going to kill on sight a salvage group entering your area and they are going to do the same to you. You have already decided that YOU will decide how these others are categorised and how you will attack them on sight, so its only fair they apply the same logic on meeting your group of your reservation with the same approach.

Yes, each group can and will determine how they will react to strangers entering their territory. Each group will also determine how they will approach or not, the people in a different territory. Once the ROL is no longer enforced by a government, then the old laws and rules go out the window. How things were handled in the past may not be the NEW normal. Many a MOUNTAIN MAN went missing after venturing into new territory. Not all the natives welcomed strangers. As in the past each tribe / culture developed their own "Rules Of Engagement" when dealing with strangers. In a WROL, I do expect each group to set their own methods of dealing with any group, including my group, who enter their territory, That would include shooting at us on sight. Their land, their resources and their rules. Not very complex.

Now as to displacement. It could become necessary to relocate due to unforeseen circumstances. In a situation like that a group would need to very carefully make contact with any other groups in any territory they planned to trespass on. The displaced group can request safe passage or offer to pay for safe passage or request permission to settle down there. If the displaced group is denied any of these requests, then they have only two choices, change directions or become the invading force.

MIND SET: People (survivors) need to understand and accept all the normal ways of doing things will have changed. Survival is the top of the list, for both the individual and the community. Anything or anybody that does not benefit the survival, is a liability. Keeping prisoners, even as a forced labor pool, is a risk not beneficial to the survival of the community. I have read members posting that allowing a doctor to stay would be beneficial, UNTIL the doctor poisons the community. Unknown people are a liability, not a benefit. Another thought, how about you let a large group stay and join the community. The community holds elections and the new group out votes your old group. Now you have a new leadership. OOP's, did not plan on that when you let them stay. Of course the old community can refuse to allow the new group to vote, yeah that won't create any hard feelings. Every past and present process needs to be weighed on the risk factor to the survival to the community. JM2C

 

[Oddcaliber]

Another aspect that has been overlooked by others including me is how to identify frend or foe! Not everyone will have com gear with a call sign. Someone posted earlier about people passing through a BOL and they turned out to be children rescued by the guy that someone in your group shot because they could not be identified. JMHO here but one should hold your fire until you have a clear target. Post SHTF a lot of people will be in transit either trying to get somewhere or away from somewhere. A lot of Vietnam veterans will agree that the worst part of the war was not knowing who the enemy really is.

 

[DrHenley]

Read my point again, First who decides there is no rule of law? At what point is it declared and by Whom?

Pretty simple actually. You dial 911 (or in your case 999) and nobody answers the phone.

 

[tmttactical]

Another aspect that has been overlooked by others including me is how to identify frend or foe! Not everyone will have com gear with a call sign. Someone posted earlier about people passing through a BOL and they turned out to be children rescued by the guy that someone in your group shot because they could not be identified. JMHO here but one should hold your fire until you have a clear target. Post SHTF a lot of people will be in transit either trying to get somewhere or away from somewhere. A lot of Vietnam veterans will agree that the worst part of the war was not knowing who the enemy really is.

Now playing Devil's Advocate. How would anybody know if the guy escorting the children is their savior or their guard? Maybe they are being takes to a sex camp to be passed around and put up for sale. Maybe the children are being used as bait to gain access to your group. How many can ignore children in need? Again, not all is as assumed or appears. Friends you will personally know. Anybody else will be foe, until proven other wise. Note the word "Proven". As to how anybody tagged as "Foe" is treated, that will again be determined by the group / community. I do agree, you don't shoot until you have identified your target.

 

[BillMasen]

Now playing Devil's Advocate. How would anybody know if the guy escorting the children is their savior or their guard? Maybe they are being takes to a sex camp to be passed around and put up for sale. Maybe the children are being used as bait to gain access to your group. How many can ignore children in need? Again, not all is as assumed or appears. Friends you will personally know. Anybody else will be foe, until proven other wise. Note the word "Proven". As to how anybody tagged as "Foe" is treated, that will again be determined by the group / community. I do agree, you don't shoot until you have identified your target.

We use a password at the moment both as a trigger word sent by text/ messenger / voice over the cell system to order the family home. and as safe word to ID friend or foe.

 

[BillMasen]

Pretty simple actually. You dial 911 (or in your case 999) and nobody answers the phone.

God help your neighbours if the 911 service is broken

 

[BillMasen]

Bloody good brainfood this thread, keep it up.

 

[tmttactical]

We use a password at the moment both as a trigger word sent by text/ messenger / voice over the cell system to order the family home. and as safe word to ID friend or foe.

A password to indicate the "Friend" is under duress. Calling out a fake name could be an automatic warning phrase. Example: Hey Bobo (no Bobo in group) , I need to reach J.C. (J.C. as in Jesus Christ) have you seen him? That phrase is not going to happen by accident and would let all know that this was a hostile contact. Another real hard situation that has to be predetermined by teh group. What happens to hostages? Is there a no negotiation policy? Will there be attempts to free a hostage or are they to be written off? Hard points to deal with but better now, then in times of emergency. The same applies to unknown children. A child suddenly showing up at your doorstep is a major problem. Now this is where many if not all will hate my guts but a child showing up is a liability in the biggest little package. A) The child is a mouth to feed and care for. B) You have to ask yourself ---How did this child get here? C) You can bet there is a less than a million to one chance this child is not a spy or at worst, an agent to assist the people that guided it to your doorstep. A child with a sibling being held by the bad guys, is going to do whatever it was told to do. Now the big question comes and you better have a plan BEFORE the child shows up. What are YOUR options?

 

[DrHenley]

God help your neighbours if the 911 service is broken

And I will be helping God help my neighbors in case they are helpless against the bad guys.

 

[Proud Prepper]

The answers to all these scenarios will depend on the stage of SHTF. How far has your local society degraded? I categorize SHTF! In 5 stages, each stage will possably have a different answer for the same scenario.

 

[Dies Irae]

Really good thread. Thank you all for all these replies. Will chip in once i get to work in 2 hours.

 

[Dies Irae]

Its nice to see all these different angles and aproaches.

For me most remains the same.
Those who just want to pass by without waving their gun around or acting tough can go on their merry way.

Families with kids will be safe to take in ( quarantine for sure ) . Like i said earlier ... im pretty sure that as long as you keep their kids fed and protected the parents will be loyal and happy.

Lonely looters or raiders decided their fate for themselfes. They killed,stole and propably did a lot of messed up stuff and the only reason for self reflection for them would be loosing a fight. They wont be feeling bad because of what they did.... they will be feeling bad only because they got caught and are now being judged.

Same goes for raider camps. Ppl in those camps will for sure know where is their fortune comming from so no bad feeling about them.

From raider camps only slaves would be aloved to leave or maybe even join in ( thats something for the whole colony to decide).

shoting on sight would be a bad idea because sooner or later you and people in your camp would be considered as raiders/danger.

Those with short,bright collored hair and piercings will be shot on sight tho.