EMP Attack?

[Maverick]

I know its not a common idea in the Prepper Community but We could be in a major SHTF situation like Civil unrest , Civil War , Terrorist, Plague, Government take over , and others where the power is on and computers , phones work . People commuting to work and stores open . Its not all primitive living and bugging out till the clothes rott off your back .

Certainly not primitive unless one is totally inept and alone but then again, if that's the case they probably wouldn't even make it to the primitive stage.

 

[Silent Earth]

I am a prepper [precisely because I dontb want to go back to victorian or cave man living, Prepping gives us the ability and capability of continuing ALMOST as normal as the world goes to California in a hand basket.

 

[DrHenley]

This was also brought up in other threads.

At the right altitude over the US effective range for an EMP affect, the US is going to see that as an direct attacked,

Sorry, I mean to specify an attack on S Korea or Japan not CONUS, but that got edited out somehow. Which is why I said "especially if N Korea is within the affected area." There isn't much to knock out in N Korea, so he could say "see, we were hit too" but in reality N Koreans would hardly notice an EMP.

 

[Maverick]

Sorry, I mean to specify an attack on S Korea or Japan not CONUS, but that got edited out somehow. Which is why I said "especially if N Korea is within the affected area." There isn't much to knock out in N Korea, so he could say "see, we were hit too" but in reality N Koreans would hardly notice an EMP.

Your right, NK wouldn't even notice a loss of power for the most part. I read that NK power is off during the night and set schedules during the day in places that have power, majority of homes don't even have power?

 

[Maverick]

Sorry, I mean to specify an attack on S Korea or Japan not CONUS, but that got edited out somehow. Which is why I said "especially if N Korea is within the affected area." There isn't much to knock out in N Korea, so he could say "see, we were hit too" but in reality N Koreans would hardly notice an EMP.

I wasn't referencing your statement Doc, I knew what you meant I was just making a general statement to the OP.

 

[DrHenley]

And...here we go:

South Korean banks brace for massive electromagnetic pulse attack from the North

 

[Maverick]

And...here we go:

South Korean banks brace for massive electromagnetic pulse attack from the North

Wouldn’t an EMP attack on any of our allies also be considered not just an act of war but be considered a nuclear attack as will by the US Military? Thus the possible opening of the Pandora’s box. On top of that, this wouldn’t just affect S.Korea’s economy but most of the Western economies would it not?

 

[Silent Earth]

Wouldn’t an EMP attack on any of our allies also be considered not just an act of war but be considered a nuclear attack as will by the US Military? Thus the possible opening of the Pandora’s box. On top of that, this wouldn’t just affect S.Korea’s economy but most of the Western economies would it not?

They would have to detonate an enhanced nuke and detonate it at least round 30,000 feet

 

[Maverick]

That's true SE. side note, I was a little short on my post above, I was commenting on the fact they were concerned with an EMP wrecking the economy. What I was trying to say, they are worried about an EMP wrecking the economy? The response to the EMP attack would do more than just an EMP in wrecking an economy If the little fat man done that it would be more than just bullets and artillery, thus an EMP would be the least of my worries.

Hardening the financial system is a good idea, but to do it to save the economy? that's 'almost' laughable.. almost

 

[Silent Earth]

I honestly think that if NK popped off a nuke the US would find it almost impossible to stop Israel, the UK, France and perhaps India from getting in pre-emptive strikes on NK. They unlike the US dont give a flying F*** about South Korea never mind NK, and they dont like being threatened.

The UK may only have 4 operational boomers but I'm guessing they are not in the Atlantic and not targeting Russia any more.

 

[Robinjopo1]

I think the grid going down from hackers messing with the computers is more likely than from emp.

Brent, it will be some yahoo in his mom's basement with nothing else to do. Or some 17 year old in Russia just screwing around like they did with the credit cards.

 

[Brent S]

Brent, it will be some yahoo in his mom's basement with nothing else to do. Or some 17 year old in Russia just screwing around like they did with the credit cards.

No doubt, it will be from some source that most were not expecting. Most governments are smart enough to not actually do it from knowing of certain reprisal. That doesn't mean they haven't been snooping around and already know how though.

 

[Gazrok]

I think the grid going down from hackers messing with the computers is more likely than from emp.

The funny thing is, the antiquity of our grid is one of the factors that best protects it. Any successful attack on the grid would also have to contain some actual ground elements taking out physical equipment. And, because so much of the grid is made up of independent and offline systems, it'd be difficult to affect a larger area without a coordinated attack with both cyber and physical elements.

It's one of the reasons Congress continually ignores the threat to the grid. However, as more and more of the grid becomes automated and online, this risk is increasing exponentially, each year.

The largest problem remains the insanely long lead time to replace key components, should they need it. Some equipment would take up to 18 months to fill an order. Now, in an urgent situation, this may be a LOT less, but even still, can you imagine a major urban center without power for a month or two even? Pure chaos after a week or more.

 

[Maverick]

The funny thing is, the antiquity of our grid is one of the factors that best protects it. Any successful attack on the grid would also have to contain some actual ground elements taking out physical equipment. And, because so much of the grid is made up of independent and offline systems, it'd be difficult to affect a larger area without a coordinated attack with both cyber and physical elements.

It's one of the reasons Congress continually ignores the threat to the grid. However, as more and more of the grid becomes automated and online, this risk is increasing exponentially, each year.

The largest problem remains the insanely long lead time to replace key components, should they need it. Some equipment would take up to 18 months to fill an order. Now, in an urgent situation, this may be a LOT less, but even still, can you imagine a major urban center without power for a month or two even? Pure chaos after a week or more.

Many of the older transformers that feed the grid are now one of a kind meaning the company that produces them are no longer in business and no backup for replacement, that where the biggest problems exist and like you said Gaz, it would take boots on the ground in a coordinated attack (key word being coordinated) to take them out, hacking alone won't take the grid down, in most of the automated facilities still have manual switches in place. Any hacking caused blackout would be short term.

 

[Gazrok]

A friend of mine works for a company that builds these custom transformers, from parts they get overseas (due to cost, of course). Now, that's not ALL this company does of course (or they'd be out of business), but at least he had some insight for me.

He says, at best, crisis situation or not, it would take about 6 months to get ALL of the pieces made (from different manufacturers), gathered here (in the US), and then assembled, from the date of order, and that's pushing it...he said generally, 18 months is the quoted lead time for it, on the rare occasion it happens. He's a bit of a prepper too...for just this reason (initially, aside from us living in FL). Typically, his company assembles things like other electrical components for industries, large scale A/C wiring units and breaker boxes, etc. if I listened right.

It was all while he was giving us some horse riding and training lessons/tips, so kind of a background discussion, for me to remember all of the details. Suffice to say, I was scared enough about our grid's reliance upon others.

 

[Gazrok]

To be honest, in FL, we Irma victims were out of power for 4 to 5 days, and I'm pleasantly surprised, that people didn't lose it, and kept it together. I think it was because we all knew it would be back on soon enough. (and generally expected about a week, so we relieved at 5 days). But, even on day 4, you could see some cracks here and there...and I wager it wouldn't take many more days for folks to get a bit crazy....

I'd really like a LOT more visibility to how things are going in Puerto Rico, where they've been out all this time....

 

[Maverick]

Some of you may find this interesting, some information on the transformers and replacement.

Infrastructure Security and Energy Restoration Office of Electricity Delivery and Energy Reliability U.S. Department of Energy

 

[Brent S]

To be honest, in FL, we Irma victims were out of power for 4 to 5 days, and I'm pleasantly surprised, that people didn't lose it, and kept it together. I think it was because we all knew it would be back on soon enough. (and generally expected about a week, so we relieved at 5 days). But, even on day 4, you could see some cracks here and there...and I wager it wouldn't take many more days for folks to get a bit crazy....

I'd really like a LOT more visibility to how things are going in Puerto Rico, where they've been out all this time....

I agree with the knowledge of it will be back on soon helps keep people from showing their worst side. If everything was out for three weeks, and no hope of restoration you would start to see the worst in humanity.

 

[Maverick]

On YouTube their are a video called; It’s insightful with information
NatGeo - Electronic Armageddon