Roving Gangs - Counter Tactics?

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There aren't a whole lot of them though (the 25mt ones), and you can bet they'll be targeted first by the BMDS (Ballistic Missile Defense System). As for gravity bombs, I'm not too worried about those here in FL. We do have some mt bombs though too, and as you said some of the bigger boys, but the vast majority are of a much smaller variety.

russia is said to be building a more powerful ICBM exceeding the ss-18 in the range of 30-40mt by 2018

I believe that technically, the treaties are history now, so either side could...just don't really see why either would commit the resources to it. After all, Russia has been worse than us in letting existing stockpiles just deteriorate, so chances are, a good deal of them wouldn't even make it out of the silos or launchers.

I get it though, we grew up (well, I did), in an age where getting nuked was a VERY real possibility, and from all we were told, a nuclear war was game over for us as a species. Looking at the real numbers now though, (and the way certain places have recovered in WAY less time than imagined), I don't think that is an accurate view at all anymore. No doubt it would be catastrophic and completely change the world, but I don't think it would end us as a species anymore.
 
True, but in essence, the idea of MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction for you pre-Cold War folks), is basically what keeps the major world powers from going to all out war between themselves. Instead, t hey hash out their differences in smaller, regional conflicts with conventional weapons and by supporting the party in line with their interests.
 
For 2 of the 3 (China is exempt), MAD isn't an issue, just their own destruction, as they can't hit back with the assured destruction. Maybe SAD (Self Assured Destruction) is a better term for them?
 
Wow, man. Good thread. It's a deep one and a toughy too. I think this is somethign that each person will have to think of in terms of their own situation. You can imagine that someone in the inner city will have more to deal with like this than some who live way out in the sticks.

It looks like you've given it quite a bit of thought and have some really good ideas... The only thing that comes to mind that you didn't mention is team members for an ambush. It goes along with the scouting and some other items you mentioned, but it is to deal with them swiftly and harshly. Of course not all "Wanderers" can be dealt with like this, but if you are in comms with neighboring camps, and they have been in a battle, the survivors may be able to alert you, in which case, ambushing them as far from your base camp as possible would be a good idea. I think it'd be human anture to want to be as close to base camp as possible, but then you run the risk of them overrunning you and being so close to camp that your team's survivors can't get out. Even this has to be thought of in fluid manner though, since you may need to be close to ammo supplies and other kit that isn't on your defenders' persons... This is the problem/blessing with tactical situations, IMHO. You have to be able to adapt to situations that you never knew to plan for, adn yet when you know that, it keeps you thinking and teaching your team to adapt and overcome as many oddball things as they can.
 
It's a firm belief of mine, that roaming gangs will (after a SHTF event) be the primary threat faced by survivors. The vast percentage are likely to be opportunists, and those can be dealt with in lots of ways, but there are likely to be some that have brains behind them too.

Some of the specific challenges.ly monitoring communications channels.
3. Likely possess vehicles.
4. Well-provisioned.
5. Used to working together.
6. Likely a bit of berserker types here.

So, aside from the obvious (i.e. large armed force of your own or trying to remain undetected), what kinds of tactics have you devised to counter this threat?

______________________________

Things I've come up with.

1. Ruining the paths leading to your place (at least during the chaos period). (fell trees over roads, use other vehicles, dig ditches, etc.) Do this far enough away so they never even see your place (and can't get vehicles there without making a LOT of noise and effort to clear).

2. Booby traps that make a lot of noise and announce there is an intruder. This is a whole other threat all its own, but things to let you know someone is closing in.

3. Booby traps that cause death or harm. While I'd feel bad if these got innocents, during the chaos period, just too risky to have visitors. Both in the outer perimeter and path areas, as well as the outskirts of the property.

4. Scouts, folks who go out on patrol not to engage any enemy, but to report back to the base with intel (and warning).

5. Having a redoubt with supplies (a very hidden place where you can flee to if the group is too large, to then come back in and reclaim, or rebuild when they move on). Attacking from the redoubt will include completely sabotaging any vehicles of the bandits, with complete hit and run tactics until at a manageable number.

6. Large fields of fire, and hardened positions for sentries (so if they approach, they do so over open-ground and where they can be easily shot from a distance). Hardened positions made using cinder blocks (filled with rebar and concrete). Built after the SHTF with stockpiled materials. (or before SHTF, and disguised as something else, like planters, etc., which is my plan.) That way, just dig out the plants, and presto! Pillbox!

7. Posts in the ground every 3' in front of fences, to prevent vehicles from driving into fences to knock them down. (just large wooden fence poles, sunk in to make a vehicle barrier....can get the supplies before hand, then put in after a SHTF event). We always have spares of these for repair anyhow, so this is just having MORE of them.

8. Nightvision. Lots of ways to cheaply keep batteries charged (especially with FL sun). Nightvision will be a big plus (even if only 1st generation). I've done simulated night combat before, and it is simple, the side that has it, if the others don't....wins.

9. If I do have to leave, I plan to leave some goodies behind, but that are poisoned. (mostly booze and the most appealing foodstuffs). Depending on the desired tactics, could be either fast acting or slow acting poisons. Unless time is pressing, the slower acting (matter of days) one is my preference (both are lethal). Long enough to thwart any taste-tester moves by an overly clever bandit, and to spread more throughout their force, but quick enough to get back in soon. The cleanup will suck, and any bandits not partaking may either fight (or flee to return later), but we'd simply assess the situation as needed.

10. Initially trying to establish a dialogue, if they seem willing to do so (and seem too numerous or costly to fight). My usual method for communicating with strangers post SHTF will be this. A remote-controlled truck is sent out, with a two-way radio in the back. Sent to the stranger to use for conversation. I'll try to convince them that leaving us here, to have constant supplies, is a better option, and that for protection from them and other gangs (as now we are a vested interest), we'll pay tribute in what we have to offer (with ground rules). Failing this, we fight anyhow, rather than die on our knees, and enact a scorched earth approach. We'll make this willingness very clear during the negotiations.
 
I spend so much time thinking about raiders its unreal. 11 years of war, Ever more violent criminal groups. All producing people with experience on spilling blood. I think the worst part is, The longer the groups survives the better it gets at raiding. I mean alot of them will be destroyed from in fighting and picking the wrong fight. But the ones that are in tune, Will be immune to everything short of being carpet bombed.
Now I have no military background to back my opinions. But I feel when faced by a extremely hostile force, If your not 100% sure your force will come out victorious. With almost no casualties. You MUST avoid engaging them at all costs. Risking losing critical personal, Or worse getting captured and having your BoL found is unacceptable.
Now I do believe you can achieve victory through pre planning hit and run attacks, miss perception. And demoralizing strikes against support & leadership elements. Every act of violence you make must result in the injury and death of as many raiders as possible. A screaming comrade is far more demoralizing then a quite one. If you can get them to dread every inch foward. You can make them fall back
 
That's just it, if it looks like you have a difficult fight on your hands, LEAVE (but leave some parting gifts). Then, hit and fade tactics. Take one out, wait, take out another, etc.

Of course, this works BOTH ways, and a raider or group may try doing this to you too. So your defenses must consider this.

But, there can be a difference. For example, YOU (after being forced out) may have nearby buried caches of supplies they don't know about, so unlike them, you can hang out longer, and wait longer between strikes to take back your place.
 
It's a well-written article, and with many valid points. However, at some point, we have to question whether or not we're willing to give up our humanity in the process of survival. I'm not so sure I would be. If a mom came to me with her kid, and they needed assistance, and I could do so, I likely would. Sure, I'd be on the lookout for her man in the bushes, or possibly even a whole band...I'm not a rube...but to not help...well, at the end of the day, I have to live with myself too.

I would take many precautions, but hopefully we could work out some kind of trade agreement. In a SHTF environment, there would be more work than ever around the ranch, so that isn't too hard a deal to strike. I will say this though. The SECOND any kind of duplicity is shown (for example, I ask if her man is out there waiting, and she says no, and turns out he is), I would have ZERO mercy, and instantly swing into protection mode. This point would be driven home right from the get go. I will make it very clear that lying makes one an instant threat, and we will deal with threats with absolute lethal force. Simply too much at risk not to.

Eventually, this person I help may even grow to become part of the community, depending on how we all mesh, etc. (and of course, the particular SHTF scenario).
 
I will never establish trade until ROL is established. After that I'll still be wary but I agree with some of Gazroks points. I will help those that I can but only in a "join us or leave" scenario. If they choose to join us we will make it clear that lying will result in immediate removal and banishment. So level with us now or else. I believe in strength in numbers. But I'm no fool... They will never know the full extent of us until we 110% trust them. I have a camp scenario with multiple levels of property. The more your trusted the higher up the hill you go. This also puts the newest members in the position of first defense and response to protect us. They will earn there keep or be banished. Pretty simple... lol
 
You have to have some trusted old-timers though too, in the first ring of defense, otherwise, the newbies could be in cahoots, and let others IN!
 
Any chance of moving this to the new Tactics forum?
 
When I think about some of the characters I've met over the years and My work means I have to deal with all kinds of situations today it is easy to see how roving gangs would be a major problem in a lawless time . Many individuals live like marauders / gangs now . I work in a very public place and responsible for overall operations and security as we don't have security to speak of thoes of us in leadership have to respond . Every thing will be going smooth and then we get a call that a trouble maker or fight is creating a scene and scareing the public . Like Forrest Gump said Life is like a box of chocolate you never know what you are going to get .
 
Come SHTF, I think gangs are a given. I just hope most of them lack the fuel and drive to range out, and that even less have capable leadership that can employ clever tactics, etc.

It's the paramilitary types I worry about, that realize that a world where might makes right, is basically theirs for the taking. The good news though, is that such men would likely be willing to entertain a treaty that benefited them in some way.
 
I know a paramilitary type group in another state that I had differances with several years ago . I hope I never run into them agin if we do I hope all bystanders know to duck and cover . Yes in a lawless world they will be a roving gang no doubt . I met these gentelmen during my younger days while looking for adventure in what they now call security contractors .
 

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