Biosphere, the ultimate prepping project

[tmttactical]

First don't get me wrong, I am not walking 20 miles to go shopping but mechanical transportation is not required to maintain life. They are required to maintain a normal modern life. AND there in lies the problem. Most folks (me Included) believe we HAVE to have or NEED to have these items. The fact is, no we don't but then we can't live a modern lifestyle without them. I am the first to admit I am not willingly giving up my current life style. The big difference is I don't whine about pollution and Global Warming. When these planet worrying environmentalist folks give up all mechanical modes of transportation, all plastic items, all fossil fuels, all metal components and return to things they can and have made from natural components, then they are entitled to complain about the sorry state of the planet, until then, they are a polluting hypocrites. You all remind me of the obese guy eating his ice cream and complaining about the high cost of medical insurance.

 

[Petoski]

Similar here Bigpaul. Living rural and growing most of our food (all fruit and veg) and use local hunters for meat. We are lucky there is still a few local food and hardware stores in the nearest town and I can cycle there when there is no snow but do still need the car and trailer for large items. Mostly I am using it to gather supplies to build infrastructure to meet my energy needs and renovate the house but I hope to be completed within the next 5 years. Eventually I would like to get rid of the car as it is my largest expense. I doubt I will go so far as to live in a biosphere but you sure would learn a lot. One of the major problems with society today is the detachment from the production processes. If people really saw how things they consume were made they probably would change their behaviour more.

 

[bigpaul]

most people over here have no idea of welfare standards or how their food is produced, most don't even know which animal it comes from and they certainly have no idea of which country it comes from, many have no idea of how the countryside works but they scream blue murder if they see a fluffy bunny rabbit being hurt on some so called farming programme on the tv.

 

[Arcticdude]

My father always says ask yourself twice, do i really need this. Most of the things we have we want but do not really need. In my opinion the world would be a better place if a) governments really focus on reducing population b) people only used what they really need and c) things that are built were built to last and easily repaired. The problem is people in general are selfish, lazy and greedy and the capitalist model thinks population growth is the key to success.

With regards to the biosphere experiment, it was conducted a long time ago. It would be interesting to see how a new experiment would work given advances in technology. The real question is wouldn't it be better to focus on the causes of the problems (humans) than trying to put a plaster over it?

And just who is going to decide what each of us "need"? The government? Is the government also going to decide where one lives? And how we live?
There are countries that decide these things for you. Communist China comes to mind. They also tried to limit population growth too. They even had forced abortions.
I do agree with you about buying products that last. That's why I try to avoid as much as possible anything made in China.
I prefer the freedom of making my own choices, good or bad, over a nanny socialist system. I also believe in minding my own business and not worry about what other people are doing.

 

[bigpaul]

I have noticed that many American's have an aversion ..nay a hatred..of anything that is made or comes from China, I have bought a few things from China not much because of the time it takes to arrive-usually about a month, but I have never had a problem with the quality, it is all well made and lasts a reasonable time, nothing I bought has worn out or broken yet.

 

[Arcticdude]

I have noticed that many American's have an aversion ..nay a hatred..of anything that is made or comes from China, I have bought a few things from China not much because of the time it takes to arrive-usually about a month, but I have never had a problem with the quality, it is all well made and lasts a reasonable time, nothing I bought has worn out or broken yet.

I guess many of us Americans that still care have a problem with communist slave labor, substandard materials and poor quality workmanship What's a reasonable time for a product to last for you BP? When I buy a tool I expect it to last a lifetime. When I'm looking to buy any product I'm buying it with the intention of it out living me.
Putting politics aside, most stuff made in China is poorly made junk. I will have to admit that the appearance of Chinese products have improved over the last few years. But the quality of the materials haven't, in most cases.
Besides, I'd rather put an American to work over a Chinaman.

 

[bigpaul]

I don't have a problem with communist sweat shops at least the poor sods have a job even if its poorly paid, and as I have already said all the stuff I bought was well made and good quality, I suspect it will all last me out, as I also said none of it has worn out or broken yet.
if some of the stuff I bought from there was made here I wouldn't be buying it from there.

 

[Petoski]

People are free to decide for themselves what items they need and what items they want but many resources are stretched because of wants. If someone wants a sex change and the health service has a limited budget and they have to cut back on medication for child Leukemia treatment I would suggest their want had a negative impact on someone else's need. I just think we should endeavour to make what little wants a person has, have as little negative impact on others as possible.

 

[Arcticdude]

People are free to decide for themselves what items they need and what items they want but many resources are stretched because of wants. If someone wants a sex change and the health service has a limited budget and they have to cut back on medication for child Leukemia treatment I would suggest their want had a negative impact on someone else's need. I just think we should endeavour to make what little wants a person has, have as little negative impact on others as possible.

Now your really going off the socialist deep end.

 

[bigpaul]

just look at plastic shopping bags, they used to be free in all the supermarkets, then the UK govt.decided to make a charge for them thinking that would cut down the use, the charge? 5p each which was derisory, that's nothing on top of someone's shopping, they just pay it, the problem remains, BIL takes 20 to the dump along with other rubbish every week, better if they made it 50p better still ban them altogether and made people use cloth bags instead. but I cant see it happening, that takes someone to have a functioning brain and most MP's are brain dead to that sort of problem.

 

[jontte]

haven't used a plastic shopping bag for ages,use those sturdy ones made of canvas,use bars of soap instead of the liquid stuff..it's kinda what you
decide to do and use,personal choices..

 

[Brent S]

haven't used a plastic shopping bag for ages,use those sturdy ones made of canvas,use bars of soap instead of the liquid stuff..it's kinda what you
decide to do and use,personal choices..

Walmart’s sell the reusable bags for a dollar at the registers usually. At that price I doubt they make any, or much, profit but it’s good to encourage people to try cutting down on waste. It’s honestly got to be tackeled on a governmental scale to really make a big difference, but even as individuals we can all make some difference.

 

[KateMTx]

I think paper bags are a better alternative to plastic because they are biodegradable and come from a sustainable resource (trees). I argue with people who complain about paper being bad for the environment because I grew up surrounded by tree farms and learned about sustainable forestry from a young age. I'm also excited about the new biodegradable plastics they are developing because I love science.
And I do like my modern lifestyle. However, I want to be prepared for TEOTWAWKI and be realistic about the very real possibility that my lifestyle will not be possible and I will have to know other ways to survive.
Regardless, I think each it is the individual's responsibility to make good choices, and the government shouldn't be telling people how to live or what kind of bags to carry their groceries in.

 

[Arcticdude]

I agree that all of us should do what we can to reduce our waste as much as possible. My wife uses cotton bags when she goes shopping instead of the plastic bags. I don't like seeing plastic bags and bottles thrown around any more than anyone else does, but I don't think that government bans are the way to go. Consumers that care can make a big impact as to what kind of packaging that manufacturers use and what the supermarkets use at the checkout stand.
During the Fall, Winter and spring I burn all of our trash, with the exception of glass and metal. All of my used oil is saved up and goes in the fire when I'm burning brush. During summer everything goes to the landfill. Overall we don't generate nearly as much trash for the landfill as most people do.
I've traveled around the world quite a bit and from what I've seen, overall the US cleaner than most other country's are.

 

[tmttactical]

Before government and the bleeding heart stupid environmentalists got involved, we all used paper bags. Those bags at Walmart are not made from all natural, renewable resources. Want to bet they are a bi-product of a fossil fuel? What happens to them when their handle breaks or a seam opens up? They are discarded into a land fill, just like the plastic bags. Want bio-bags, go back to paper.

 

[Arcticdude]

Before government and the bleeding heart stupid environmentalists got involved, we all used paper bags. Those bags at Walmart are not made from all natural, renewable resources. Want to bet they are a bi-product of a fossil fuel? What happens to them when their handle breaks or a seam opens up? They are discarded into a land fill, just like the plastic bags. Want bio-bags, go back to paper.

The dirty little secret the enviro nuts don't want to acknowledge is, that there isn't a single product made that doesn't use petroleum products somewhere in the manufacturing process. And of course nothing gets shipped without petroleum.
If I remember correctly, paper bags use a lot of formaldehyde in the manufacturing process. Formaldehyde has been demonized by the tree huggers too. Ever been close to a pulp mill? You can smell them for miles.

 

[jontte]

aaah,the smell from a paper mill,here they use to say ;it's the smell of money

 

[jontte]

and prolly in the future,when some archeologist is digging and they send "our bones and stuff" to the lab,they find "interesting chems" they will
be wondering,what the hell were they doing??
if humans come that far...

 

[bigpaul]

maybe, but the way the human race is going, I doubt very much if there will be any "future", we'll probably breed ourselves out of existence.

 

[Brent S]

Katmx mentioned biodegradable plastics. Hope this can become a viable product before too long. Would help solve a lot of issues. Science could solve most of our issues. Unfortunately greed directs where science is applied mostly.