Nothing practical, and as Krime pointed out it would be a very dangerous thing to work with, very few people have the expertise to work with such high voltages, most of your tools, multimeters etc would blow up or cause an arc.
Solar
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Brent S
Top Poster
I used to work with neon signs, and 15,000 volt transformers were pretty common. They had almost no amperage, but needed the voltage to excite the particles in the gas tubes. The single conductor wire had a thick rubber like coating, and you had to take care to run it so it didn't touch anything by using insulator stands and glass tubing. We used to joke that getting hit won't kill you as the amperage is so low, but the reaction from getting hit will get you when you fall out of the bucket or off the roof.
Yeah that sort of HV will cause your muscles to react and that can be fatal if you're on a roof or whatever as you say 
Did you guys have those perspex wheel things at school? The teacher would wind it up and the static charge would reach about 20kv IIRC, he would get the entire class to hold hands and the two end guys would grab the thing. We all tried to get in the middle of the string thinking it would hurt less. It doesn't
For that matter I'm guessing that most of us here have been zapped by HT leads on a petrol motor with spark plugs. All good fun but no current, you just bash your head on the bonnet.
Did you guys have those perspex wheel things at school? The teacher would wind it up and the static charge would reach about 20kv IIRC, he would get the entire class to hold hands and the two end guys would grab the thing. We all tried to get in the middle of the string thinking it would hurt less. It doesn't
For that matter I'm guessing that most of us here have been zapped by HT leads on a petrol motor with spark plugs. All good fun but no current, you just bash your head on the bonnet.
Brent S
Top Poster
I still hate getting shocked more than just about anything else! I remember walking with a young girl when I was about 14, she reached over and took my hand in hers, and I'm diggin it, thinking she really liked me. Then she reached over with the other hand and grabbed the hot wire on the horse fence and lit me up! So much for young romance.Yeah that sort of HV will cause your muscles to react and that can be fatal if you're on a roof or whatever as you say
Did you guys have those perspex wheel things at school? The teacher would wind it up and the static charge would reach about 20kv IIRC, he would get the entire class to hold hands and the two end guys would grab the thing. We all tried to get in the middle of the string thinking it would hurt less. It doesn't
For that matter I'm guessing that most of us here have been zapped by HT leads on a petrol motor with spark plugs. All good fun but no current, you just bash your head on the bonnet.
Brent S
Top Poster
I'm looking at running a 120v 10 amp fridge for approx 8 hrs of run time a day. I am figuring a 1200 watt system with 5 100amp hr deep cell batteries and a 2000watt continuous inverter and battery tender. Any input on system size?
My first thought was that that is heaps as it's over 2x the size of the system I just put in for two fridges (although admittedly mine is a little undersized because I just used some old panels I had lying around).
Then I did the maths on that fridge 120V x 10A x 8h x 365days = 3.5 MILLION watt/hours per year. (did I miss something? Correct me if I'm wrong, it wouldn't be the first time). That's the worst fridge I've ever heard of, is it really old? My two new ones (separate fridge and freezer pigeon pair) only draw about 600kwh per year (according to the specs anyway), and that's for both of them.
Then I did the maths on that fridge 120V x 10A x 8h x 365days = 3.5 MILLION watt/hours per year. (did I miss something? Correct me if I'm wrong, it wouldn't be the first time). That's the worst fridge I've ever heard of, is it really old? My two new ones (separate fridge and freezer pigeon pair) only draw about 600kwh per year (according to the specs anyway), and that's for both of them.
Been there, done that, got the T-shirt on both
The worst however was when I tried to pick up an electric ray with an aluminum framed net. .
And yep, I hate like hell getting shocked.
Brent S
Top Poster
It's a modern fridge, with led lights and all, but is really large and has an extra large freezer and thru the door everything. I'll put an amp meter on it and see what it actually pulls, but the label is 10amps. I don't care much about appliances normally, but like to cook a lot so I got a really nice fridge. Now that I want to get it set up with solar I am kind of questioning that! Yeah my math did the same thing. I do think I could do with 4 batteries, but the fifth should make them all last longer from over cycling. I'll check my freezer and see what it pulls and may start with it. I have mostly led lights in the house so it wouldn't be too hard to get them on a circuit as well. The fridge or freezer is what is most important to me though. Yeah, 3500kwh is a lot.
Krime
M.I.A.
forgive me, but just cuz one is an electrical engineer doesn't mean they know how to wire a dang thing, but im sure you can draw one hell of a blueprint cant you? I could simply pull out my NEC code book where it states volts are the flow if you like, I believe its in section 100 definitions. theres a huge difference between an Engineer and an actual electrician. one of the sites he gave me actually had 1000v panels, which made me laugh a bit too cuz 245w 1000v panels would give a .245 amps which would give you virtually nothing. heres another site just for you though from about a year ago.
http://www.kyocerasolar.com/about-kyocera/kyocera-solar/news/?id=171
Krime
M.I.A.
10a and im sure you're plugging it into a 120 outlet that comes out to (ExI=P) 1200w/245w panel= 5 panel system just to run that fridge.
That link you provided is to a press release, as such it is worth nothing but let's look at it anyway.
Yes it uses the phrase "1000-volt modules" but then we see
Staying with Kyocera, let's look at their current offerings.
http://www.kyocerasolar.com.au/australia/solar-panels/current-products.htm
None of these panels product 1000 volts, not even close. They are all 36-, 24- or 12-volt (nominal) panels. Note however that most of them are rated for use in a 1000-volt system, which is what I suggested would be the case in my first post on this subject.
That press release is a year old, so either the 1000-volt panels didn't work out or they are in fact referring to the system voltage.
www.robgray.com/temp/Schematic.pdf
In fact I've been earning a living from doing just that for years, still do on a consulting basis.
I think I managed to get through that without resorting to sarcasm as you did, I am prepared to be proved wrong re these 1000-volt panels (I was wrong once before), but until you can produce hard data of a single panel/module that generates 1000-volts I plan to rest my case.
Yes it uses the phrase "1000-volt modules" but then we see
Note it's the system that's 1000 volts, not the module. There are multiple modules in a string and it's that string that produces 1000 volts.
60- and 80-cell modules, let's do the maths. 1000 / 60 = 16.67, so if these panels are generating 1000 volts each cell is producing nearly 17 volts, something I've never heard of and it appears neither has Kyocera, from their site
If you have found cells that can generate 33 times the industry norm I would like to hear more.
Staying with Kyocera, let's look at their current offerings.
http://www.kyocerasolar.com.au/australia/solar-panels/current-products.htm
None of these panels product 1000 volts, not even close. They are all 36-, 24- or 12-volt (nominal) panels. Note however that most of them are rated for use in a 1000-volt system, which is what I suggested would be the case in my first post on this subject.
That press release is a year old, so either the 1000-volt panels didn't work out or they are in fact referring to the system voltage.
I've never heard the term "blueprint" used in electronics, but if you mean "schematic" yes I can, here's an example
www.robgray.com/temp/Schematic.pdf
In fact I've been earning a living from doing just that for years, still do on a consulting basis.
I also spent years crawling under buildings, pulling wires up lift shafts, terminating cables as thick as your thumb, and soldering wires so thin you need magnification to see them properly. I've "done my time" as they say, both in the field and at a desk. But it seems that you have more experience and are accusing me of being a theory-only desk jockey despite the fact that you "only have about 3 months till I graduate". That's a bit rich.
I think I managed to get through that without resorting to sarcasm as you did, I am prepared to be proved wrong re these 1000-volt panels (I was wrong once before
), but until you can produce hard data of a single panel/module that generates 1000-volts I plan to rest my case.Moving right along, back to Brent's fridge.
10A x 8h x 120V = 9600Wh required per day.
In general with solar systems you assume 5 hours useful sunlight per day, that obviously is very dependent on location and season but let's use that figure for now. So in 5 hours the panels have to generate 9600Wh. That's 1920 watts per hour, so you need 1920 watts of panels. The physical makeup of the panels is pretty much immaterial but assuming 250w panels that's (rounded up) 8 panels required, I would add another 1 or 2 to allow for losses in the regulator and inverter. Someone please check my maths, I was out by a factor of 10 when I first did the numbers
This assumes that the 8 hours running per day is correct, how have you determined that?
Battery bank size is another thing that is (sort of) unrelated to this and requires various tradoffs to be made.
10A x 8h x 120V = 9600Wh required per day.
In general with solar systems you assume 5 hours useful sunlight per day, that obviously is very dependent on location and season but let's use that figure for now. So in 5 hours the panels have to generate 9600Wh. That's 1920 watts per hour, so you need 1920 watts of panels. The physical makeup of the panels is pretty much immaterial but assuming 250w panels that's (rounded up) 8 panels required, I would add another 1 or 2 to allow for losses in the regulator and inverter. Someone please check my maths, I was out by a factor of 10 when I first did the numbers
This assumes that the 8 hours running per day is correct, how have you determined that?
Battery bank size is another thing that is (sort of) unrelated to this and requires various tradoffs to be made.
Krime
M.I.A.
forgive me, but you stated Engineer, not "Electrician", you stated that you did a few solar systems, not actual electrical work. one of the companies he provided showed a 1000v 245-275 panels, i even showed it to my teacher and we both had a laugh because they would be virtually useless especially for the money, however, making me seem like a liar, i cant seem to find them -_- .
you would not need to times it times 8hrs as 5 panels would run at a constant especially at peak hours (though you're right, peak hours depend on azimuth [latitude longitude of your system placement and barometric pressure from sea level and location ] and Zenith) which around where i am is 5.5 peak hours to where it gets optimum efficacy using Ohms Law 10aX120v=1200w 1200/245=4.898 that's 5 panels because of the overage of 4. and just cuz the sun isn't at Zenith doesn't mean its not racking in irradiance, only no sunlight hitting the panel, or shadowing can actually stop a panel from working.
and yes 3 months left, where ive hooked up a few different racks at 20 panels at a time and completely wired them myself, from the shut offs to the inverter, to the shutoff to the utility. ive received an A in every course except electrical troubleshooting, which was a bit$h i got a B, and the course review i got a B because i only showed up 4 days that term because of home issues prohibited me from going to school and attendance is 30% of the grade....yet i still pulled off a B, ive also had 5 job offers and 3 of the top companies begging me to interview, and im not out of school yet.....not to mention 18+ years exp in previous construction industries....so ya, don't scoff....
you would not need to times it times 8hrs as 5 panels would run at a constant especially at peak hours (though you're right, peak hours depend on azimuth [latitude longitude of your system placement and barometric pressure from sea level and location ] and Zenith) which around where i am is 5.5 peak hours to where it gets optimum efficacy using Ohms Law 10aX120v=1200w 1200/245=4.898 that's 5 panels because of the overage of 4. and just cuz the sun isn't at Zenith doesn't mean its not racking in irradiance, only no sunlight hitting the panel, or shadowing can actually stop a panel from working.
and yes 3 months left, where ive hooked up a few different racks at 20 panels at a time and completely wired them myself, from the shut offs to the inverter, to the shutoff to the utility. ive received an A in every course except electrical troubleshooting, which was a bit$h i got a B, and the course review i got a B because i only showed up 4 days that term because of home issues prohibited me from going to school and attendance is 30% of the grade....yet i still pulled off a B, ive also had 5 job offers and 3 of the top companies begging me to interview, and im not out of school yet.....not to mention 18+ years exp in previous construction industries....so ya, don't scoff....
flatheadlakeprepper
Member
Krime, could you (if you don't mind revealing ti), tell me where your getting this degree from? Is it an online education? Given my location, an online education is the only viable option available and I'd be interested if you could point me in a good direction. I have a strong background in engineering and physics and have read some great primers, but have always felt that before I really delve into and implement a solar solution, I need some more education and a good review of my calculations. It sounds like a degree program may be more than what I need, but I tend to go overboard with things so it would be in keeping with my general characteristics especially since the subject interests me.
Krime
M.I.A.
I go to the University of Antelope Valley, no its not online, though I believe there are online schools for it, and yes associates degree
Krime
M.I.A.
flatheadlakeprepper
Member
Krime,
Thanks for the information and for planting the seed. I think I'll start checking into finding a decent online program and pursue it.
Krime
M.I.A.
np, heres the book we run a LOT out of, its pretty much the Solar bible, it WILL teach you pretty much everything you need to know except actually doing it, but has all the knowledge youll needKrime,
Thanks for the information and for planting the seed. I think I'll start checking into finding a decent online program and pursue it.
http://www.constructionbook.com/pho...egs&epc=885Y&gclid=CJOmhvzFqsICFceVfgodV4gAbg
